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Assyrian Independence?
#1
I know Assyria is trying to make an administrative zone right now, but obviously Assyrians throughout the world want their own state away from Iraqi rule and Kurdish opression. I've been discussing the issue of northern Iraq with some friends, and I have some questions to pose for everyone.

Firstly, if we give Assyria and Kurdistan independence, would this not create conflicts such as the ones in the former Yugoslav areas today, where many cultures are fighting over the same cultural sacred areas? I understand that Muslims in both Bosnia and Assyria have simply taken over areas to make them sacred, but problems may still arise. I look at Bosnia and Yugoslavia as the worst outcome of Assyrian Independence, but then look at Croatia and Slovenia as possibly a very good outcome of Assyrian independence. In other words, either something really good would happen to Assyria (God willing), or something really bad would happen.

Second, how would Assyria survive? What resources would Assyria have? I mean, it's not a lot of land, but enough. But I don't think there are many resources that Assyrians could use to trade in the international market. Further, they would have to constantly have permission from Iraq to use the Tigris. Many Assyrians compare their nation to Israel before it's independence, but geographically speaking a better comparison would be Armenia, with no geographic bodies of water touching the nation, and being surrounded by Islamic nations. Assyria may have the same problems with Kurdistan as Armenia is having with Azerbajain.

Finally- what would be Assyria's national city? It's very important for Assyria to have a national capital, but the problem is that national capital would be contraversal- Mosul is on top of it. The other city Assyria identifies with is Assur, but that wouldn't be in Assyrian territory either (if we look at the proposed Administrative map). This is easily up for contraversy.

So what does everyone think? I'm all for Assyrian independence, but many problems could arise from it. I know Armenia was in a shockingly similar situation, but we must be prepared for the worse.
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#2
Shlama Akhi,

The biggest obstacle to Assyrian independence is the religion factor. All (or most) Assyrians are Christians of various flavors (Catholic, SOC, CoE, and sizable Protestant communities.)

I can't imagine any toleration for a Christian island within the Muslim ocean of the middle east. At least Armenia, while surrounded by Muslim states on the south and east, backs up to Russia. The last Christian state in the middle east, Lebanon, fought a bitter civil war to keep its independence yet still managed to fall under Syria's domination.

Any support for Assyrian independence by a "Christian" state like the U.S. would be seen as a "crusade" against Muslim lands.

I'd love an independent state - but not if it means paying the same sort of price that Israelis (and Palestinians) pay everyday.

I think the best solution, at least in the short term, would be to have an autonomous region in a federal Iraq where Assyrian religious, linguistic and cultural practices could be nurtured and preserved.
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
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#3
....and this is gonna spice up my term paper--that disgustingly awful seven page load!

Tell me, since the invasion of Iraq, Hussain's fall, and the country's occupation, has the United States spoke of any plans to establish independance for the Assyrians? How many Assyrians died under that wrench? Has the US made plans to liberate any other minority group tormented under that wrench?
???Do not give up, for that is ignorance and not according to the rules of this art... Like the lover, you cannot hope to achieve success without infinite perseverance.???
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#4
Shlama Akhi bar-Khela,

What seven page download?

I don't think it's in the US's interest to liberate anybody right now, especially not Christians like the Assyrians. We don't want to be seen as "Crusaders."

If the US tried to give any sort of independence to the Kurds, all hell would break loose in Iraq. And the Kurds are Muslims.

Imagine giving an inch of land to Christians?

The Assyrians, unless drastic measures are put into place, will no longer exist as a distinct people in 2 or 3 generations and the Aramaic language will die out.
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#5
WEll that's the thing- IF Iraq gives Kurdistan independence, Assyria would have to follow.
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#6
I agree...especially considering that all the archaeological artifacts buried under all modern "Kurdish" areas are, in fact, Assyrian. All those mounds and buried treasures of early civilization are Assyrian, not "Kurdish."

There was never such a thing as "Kurdistan" - Kurds are Indo-Europeans originally from Iran. They are invaders to Mesopotamia.

The Kurds are hypocrites by crying for a "homeland", while at the same time they don't support the Assyrian right to a "homeland"....it becomes more outrageous when you consider that they are invaders in Assyrian lands, to begin with! <!-- s:mad: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/mad.gif" alt=":mad:" title="Mad" /><!-- s:mad: -->
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#7
I'm curious, isn't Syria supposed to be the "Assyrian" homeland? I understand that the location isn't the right place, but they wouldn't have named it "Syria" if they didn't expect Assyrians to live there.
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#8
shlomo lkoolhoon,

it's interesting to note that, before the Islamic invasions (which forced by force Islam and Arabic on everyone) the middle-east was mostly Christian Countries (ex: Iraq, Byzantine, Lebanon, Syriac, etc...) that spoke Aramaic, yet the Christian communities have lost their voice in the middle-east, and are considered a second class citizen by Arab Muslim rulers. The issue of the middle-east seems unsolvable!

poosh bashlomo,
keefa-moroon
P.S. Hopefully one day everyone well respect everyone else, and we'll have peace in the middle-east.
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#9
Shlama Akhi Rob,

Rob Wrote:I'm curious, isn't Syria supposed to be the "Assyrian" homeland? I understand that the location isn't the right place, but they wouldn't have named it "Syria" if they didn't expect Assyrians to live there.

It's true that the ancient Greeks called "Assyrians" by the name "Syrians", but that has no relationship to the modern country called "Syria." That country was created after the collapse of the Ottoman empire during WWI.

Syrians are Arabs.
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#10
I'm all fired up for Assyrian independence! I think if America is really a Christian country like what some wanted to believe, supporting Assyrian Christians should be America's main priority. In fact, America should support Assyrians more than they support Israel.

Too bad that America is not a Christian nation.

If Assyria is formed I am afraid that the Assyrians will be hated by the muslims just like the way Jews are being hated in muslim world.

Assyrians have more legitimate claim to Assyria than the Arab's claim for 'Palestine.'

Thank you Paul for your clarification about Syria, because this is the fact that I wanted to ask for a long time now but didn't ask. <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile -->

One more thing. Is 'Palestine' a Greek word or Arabic? If it is Greek then how could 'Palestinian' be a race?
One of the first owners of the facsimile of <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0802837867/ref=nosim/ultimyourulti-20"><b>Codex Leningrad</b></a>
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#11
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+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#12
Palestinians are a mixture of peoples. They are Philistines; original Caananites; Arabs; Christian Arabs; Greek; they're just mixed, like the Maltese.
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#13
shlomo oh bjford,

bjford Wrote:Palestinians are a mixture of peoples. They are
Philistines; original Caananites; Arabs; Christian Arabs; Greek; they're just mixed, like the Maltese.

There's no such thing as Arab Christian ethnicity in Palestine.
They're Christians of Canaanite descent.

poosh bashlomo,
keefa-moroon
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#14
Correct, but many Palestinians are simply Christian Arabs. Again, there is no ethnic identity of the Palestinians- they are mixtures. In fact, some of them are tribal people who tried to take over Iraq, Iran, and Jordan before.
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#15
shlomo oh bjford,

bjford Wrote:Correct, but many Palestinians are simply Christian Arabs. Again, there is no ethnic identity of the Palestinians- they are mixtures. In fact, some of them are tribal people who tried to take over Iraq, Iran, and Jordan before.

What's the origin of an Arab Christian?

In which country are the Arab Christian from? And where are they located?

poosh bashlomo,
keefa-moroon
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