09-30-2004, 10:05 PM
Hello Dave
No they are good for proving thigns with estimates of likelyhood.. from not likely to 99.999% etc. likely ... a simplification but you get the point... but you can manipulate to the naive to make things look more statistical than a good reputable statistician would... as someone once said "there are lies, damn lies and statistics"
yeh, and Isaac Netwon a genius who created calculus to explain physics and figured out classical gravity... but he also dabbled in alchemy thinking he could turn lead to gold (and the lead probably gave him neurological problems as he was known to have) and he too tried to prove bible codes.. so even reputable scientists can delude themselves and even subconsciously manipuate statitscs and reason to prove things that their psyche needs to prove for one reason or another. But I am not a know it all, so they bible codes MIGHT be legit.. I have not seen the statistical approaches and verification to say how LIKELY.. but my psyche tells me it probably is a scam or wishful thinking, more likely the later.
don't ask questions if the answer is going to upset you... so i hope this does not upset you.. but no I don't believe in prophecy, I believe time is linear and that the mind does not have some time machine to see into the future, not prophets and I don't even know what form God takes... I assume he is all space and time so if that is true then yeh he knows the future cause in a way he has seen all time happen already, but I don't think for one minute that he someone conveys that info to any human.... so i don't believe in prophecy anymore than i believe in astrology or psychics or anything supernatural for that matter, not devils, not ghosts, not ressurected spirits... i believe what goodness we sincerely create and are, is our eternity in the time it exists... other than that from dirt to dirt as they say.
I think some things and all things taught by Jesus are TRUE in that they TRUEFULLY tell us how humanity and us as individuals shoudl be inside and outside and deal with others and make a fair kind and just world... beyond that, the rest is no more believable to me than any pagan religion myths and deities or even voodoo beliefs... I come here as a person of Assyrian ethnicity, brought up Christian who is more a gnostic christian and a bit agnostic but who thinks that the Peshitta has the real teachings of Jesus, so I want to learn more and hope that thinking that is not just wishful thinking but you all here can prove it to me and I can learn about the language of my ancestors, the religion of my family and myself in the process.
Blessings to you to Dave. I can tell you are a good man.
Shushan
Quote:Be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything
So true. Does that mean statistics are only good for manipulation?
They can also prove that a particular man is the father of a particular child.
No they are good for proving thigns with estimates of likelyhood.. from not likely to 99.999% etc. likely ... a simplification but you get the point... but you can manipulate to the naive to make things look more statistical than a good reputable statistician would... as someone once said "there are lies, damn lies and statistics"
Quote:i have submitted all the data to a professional statistician for verification. He says the codes are there by design, not chance. The stats are pretty easy to do.Everything is tested against control texts- non Bible texts searched for the same words at the same skip rates.
yeh, and Isaac Netwon a genius who created calculus to explain physics and figured out classical gravity... but he also dabbled in alchemy thinking he could turn lead to gold (and the lead probably gave him neurological problems as he was known to have) and he too tried to prove bible codes.. so even reputable scientists can delude themselves and even subconsciously manipuate statitscs and reason to prove things that their psyche needs to prove for one reason or another. But I am not a know it all, so they bible codes MIGHT be legit.. I have not seen the statistical approaches and verification to say how LIKELY.. but my psyche tells me it probably is a scam or wishful thinking, more likely the later.
Quote:I don't subscribe to the idea that "Quote:
bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".
However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
don't ask questions if the answer is going to upset you... so i hope this does not upset you.. but no I don't believe in prophecy, I believe time is linear and that the mind does not have some time machine to see into the future, not prophets and I don't even know what form God takes... I assume he is all space and time so if that is true then yeh he knows the future cause in a way he has seen all time happen already, but I don't think for one minute that he someone conveys that info to any human.... so i don't believe in prophecy anymore than i believe in astrology or psychics or anything supernatural for that matter, not devils, not ghosts, not ressurected spirits... i believe what goodness we sincerely create and are, is our eternity in the time it exists... other than that from dirt to dirt as they say.
Quote:If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?
I think some things and all things taught by Jesus are TRUE in that they TRUEFULLY tell us how humanity and us as individuals shoudl be inside and outside and deal with others and make a fair kind and just world... beyond that, the rest is no more believable to me than any pagan religion myths and deities or even voodoo beliefs... I come here as a person of Assyrian ethnicity, brought up Christian who is more a gnostic christian and a bit agnostic but who thinks that the Peshitta has the real teachings of Jesus, so I want to learn more and hope that thinking that is not just wishful thinking but you all here can prove it to me and I can learn about the language of my ancestors, the religion of my family and myself in the process.
Blessings to you to Dave. I can tell you are a good man.
Shushan