Poll: Do you believe God coded the Bible ?
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Bible Codes in Peshitta
#31
[b] <!-- s:listen: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/listen.gif" alt=":listen:" title="Listen" /><!-- s:listen: --> Guys,guys,guys: Look at yourselves, arguing over who's right and who is wrong! just what the devil ordered! Maybe this code stuff is good but maybe not. The way I see it, is that if a person is a believer and is of the right substance of faith, the need to prove that the bible is the inspired word of YHWH is unessesary. Yes' prove it's accuracy as far as translations go compaired to the greek due to mans evil desires and misunderstanding of the aramaic language, but leave the lets prove it's real stuff out. I know it's real, my spirit tells me so every day. It does [the word] say go into the world and preach the gospel but nowhere that I have read says to try and prove it's the word of YHWH. I really don't think the father meant that we humans needed to be scholars or mathematicians to read or understand his word, but after a few scribes got done with thier own agenda, it left us with a little less of the truth and understanding and more questions about why. Faith is the key to having the father answer ALL your prayers even if it's not his perfect will for you, and prayer of the right kind will most certainly win favor with him. I pray that you all don't missunderstand me but I am only trying to point a few things out after reading this and found that not many mentioned taking this to the prayer room. I understand why paul would think that it 'could' help in the understanding of the primacy of the beloved peshitta and bring this view to others, but it could also confuse people too. There is not much time left so it only would be logical to focus on his will for us and not get sidetracked with the small stuff, faith,prayer and truth are the guides to the bosom of YHWH ,and this was handed down by our forefathers and has not changed to this day. So let's not try to prove it but lets finish translating to correct the mistranslations and put our hearts and minds in his hands and surely his will be done! Blessings on you all from the bottom of my heart. Richard <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile --> aka mrripleyhere
Reply
#32
Shlama Akhi Dave:
I begin to think this dialogue is like a deaf???s one and that it???s not worthwhile, but allow me to answer a few things.

And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children
Well, you must know that these counts in the Bible are not accurate, there???re actually ???inflated??? because of the Theological intentions of the author: it wasn???t to give an exact census of the population but to magnify the Glory of YHWH. Modern serious historical studies reveal that the group that went out from Egypt wasn???t so numerous...

You ask many questions which I have not time to answer. I will say that I reject the idea that the disciples believed the resurrection based on previous faith they had in Him.
I didn???t mean that, exactly. Remember Corinthians 12:3: ???and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," (= To believe in the Resurrection) except by the Holy Spirit. Even the Apostles.

Read Mark 16. The disciples disbelieved the women's report that Jesus was risen.
This ???difficulty in believe??? (another iterative issue in the Resurrection tales) points out the necessity of the spiritual ???evidence??? internally performed by the Roukha dQoudesha, without which SEEING the Risen Jesus wouldn???t be useless. The previous faith in Jesus was just the ???spark??? of their LATER perfect Faith, developed not precisely by the mere sight of Jesus, but by his voice (???Maria!???, Joh 20:16) or a ???Sign??? performed by Him (breaking the bread, Lk 24:30-31; fishing Joh 21:6), which made disciples and Mary to RECOGNIZE Jesus (Ipse, non Isdem).
They would agree with Paul who says in 2 Cor 5:16 ???So from now on we regard no one from a worldly (lit.: ???in the flesh???) point of view. Though we once regarded Christ in this way, we do so no longer???.

Matthew 28:17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him:
It???s not said: ???...they believed in him??? (because they saw Him). The worship is also an EXPRESION OF FAITH, not the Faith itself. The ???prove??? that SEEING is not enough is just in the following phrase...

BUT SOME DOUBTED. Even actually SEEING Him?

I reserved for the end this sentence of yours, which seems to me really astonishing:

Because the codes I am looking for require a computer means that if they are valid, God reserved them for our generation to discover.

So, do you think that the millions of people who lived before, in these more than 2 millenniums ???and who didn???t have computers, of course???weren???t saved? So We are the ???selected??? generation, not the Apostles! Doesn???t seem that a huge and proud pretension?
Mt 11:25: "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children???.
(Maybe Maran Yeshoua should change his phrase into: ???"I praise you, Father... and revealed them to those who have computers???).

[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]Fwx0b[/font]
Ab. Valentin
Reply
#33
Brother Richard:
I totally agree with you! Let's focus in the main thing...

Ab. Valentin
Reply
#34
Brother Valentin,

You deny the veracity of Exodus and yet you accept the veracity of archeology on the numbers of people crossing the Red Sea 3500 years ago?

If it were left to archeology, we would never have known about the Exodus of Israel and many other historical events.

You display your ignorance by that one statement alone, yet you accuse me of getting off track of the main issue. If you don't believe in the plain statements of scripture, I don't think you can know what the main issue really is, unless you attempt to conceal the fact that you really don't believe in the word of God and wish to subvert others who do.
By stating that Exodus is in error, not because of a copyist's mistake, but by original intention of the author,(to magnify the glory of Yahweh ?) you reveal your true spirit as a "robber that breaks through and steals".
And where do you get the nonsense that the author of Exodus(Moses, or do you subscribe to the Documentary Hypothesis garbage-JEDPH Theory?) manufactured inflated numbers for the greater glory of God? Where do you find those bylaws?

There are many such "preachers of the gospel" who have no gospel to preach. They are thieves who steal faith because they have none of their own.

Where did I ever say that Bible codes are salvation ? Where did I say that people who don't know Bible codes are not saved? I was saved almost thirty years before even hearing of Bible codes.

That's pathetic, Ab, that you would dismiss something so flippantly and grossly misrepresent it because you don't understand it. You obviously haven't spent much time studying or reading material (there are quite a few books) on the codes and yet dismiss them out of hand;not a very intelligent approach , to say the least.

I believe you said you are a pastor. I pray for your soul; all your talk of faith seems to betray a sore lack of it on your part. I pray also for your flock which must be in sore need of nourishment.


Grace to you,

Dave B
Reply
#35
Shlama Valentin, I too also was bemused by your comments. Do you believe that the Bible is in error? If it is, how could you have been sure all those years of teaching others from the Bible?
Reply
#36
Shlama, David,
Personally, I admit that God coded the Peshitta. Although I did not find this topic in the Bible.
Logically, if God created the Peshitta, so the codes which are in the Peshitta are created by Him. If God created trees, so everything in the trees is created by Him.
God is the Creator.
Everything has meaningful structures, I believe.
Ivan.
Reply
#37
Interesting topic. I have not analysed the statistical data but be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything. My gut says that there are no God implanted Bible Codes in any language, and even if statistics show it is a one in a large number chance, that could just mean it is that one in a large number chance.. i.e. it is probably by chance just not likely... just like evolutionary theory says that human intelligence was a probably step in evolution but just not likely but we are all still here intelligent enough to discuss this but not intelligent enough to see clearly sometimes.

I think if God encoded anything it is the most fundamental of physics and therein lies God's mystery... the rest science can explain. I think it is more likey that we humans have encoded something from our inner psyche into all religions and their words and versions of God... God more than likely is above all this encoding games... besides the basic premise of bible codes goes against the basic premise of the bible. One of the basic premises of the bible is that god created the world and humans and gave us free will so that explains why there is good and evil and we have the free will to choose... but if the bible codes already have all history encoded in them by God then everything is predetermined and we have no free will to shape our fate beyond what is already encoded in the Bible... so I choose to think it is just a fun exercise in mathematical manipulation and God works through our souls and our deeds and not through predetermined fated codes in books written by men.
Reply
#38
Hello Se7en.

Interesting name. What does it mean ?
You wrote :
Quote:Be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything

So true. Does that mean statistics are only good for manipulation?
They can also prove that a particular man is the father of a particular child.

i have submitted all the data to a professional statistician for verification. He says the codes are there by design, not chance. The stats are pretty easy to do.Everything is tested against control texts- non Bible texts searched for the same words at the same skip rates.

I don't subscribe to the idea that "
Quote:bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".


However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?

Blessings ,


Dave
Reply
#39
Hello Dave

Quote:Be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything

So true. Does that mean statistics are only good for manipulation?
They can also prove that a particular man is the father of a particular child.

No they are good for proving thigns with estimates of likelyhood.. from not likely to 99.999% etc. likely ... a simplification but you get the point... but you can manipulate to the naive to make things look more statistical than a good reputable statistician would... as someone once said "there are lies, damn lies and statistics"

Quote:i have submitted all the data to a professional statistician for verification. He says the codes are there by design, not chance. The stats are pretty easy to do.Everything is tested against control texts- non Bible texts searched for the same words at the same skip rates.

yeh, and Isaac Netwon a genius who created calculus to explain physics and figured out classical gravity... but he also dabbled in alchemy thinking he could turn lead to gold (and the lead probably gave him neurological problems as he was known to have) and he too tried to prove bible codes.. so even reputable scientists can delude themselves and even subconsciously manipuate statitscs and reason to prove things that their psyche needs to prove for one reason or another. But I am not a know it all, so they bible codes MIGHT be legit.. I have not seen the statistical approaches and verification to say how LIKELY.. but my psyche tells me it probably is a scam or wishful thinking, more likely the later.

Quote:I don't subscribe to the idea that "Quote:
bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".

However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?

don't ask questions if the answer is going to upset you... so i hope this does not upset you.. but no I don't believe in prophecy, I believe time is linear and that the mind does not have some time machine to see into the future, not prophets and I don't even know what form God takes... I assume he is all space and time so if that is true then yeh he knows the future cause in a way he has seen all time happen already, but I don't think for one minute that he someone conveys that info to any human.... so i don't believe in prophecy anymore than i believe in astrology or psychics or anything supernatural for that matter, not devils, not ghosts, not ressurected spirits... i believe what goodness we sincerely create and are, is our eternity in the time it exists... other than that from dirt to dirt as they say.

Quote:If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?

I think some things and all things taught by Jesus are TRUE in that they TRUEFULLY tell us how humanity and us as individuals shoudl be inside and outside and deal with others and make a fair kind and just world... beyond that, the rest is no more believable to me than any pagan religion myths and deities or even voodoo beliefs... I come here as a person of Assyrian ethnicity, brought up Christian who is more a gnostic christian and a bit agnostic but who thinks that the Peshitta has the real teachings of Jesus, so I want to learn more and hope that thinking that is not just wishful thinking but you all here can prove it to me and I can learn about the language of my ancestors, the religion of my family and myself in the process.

Blessings to you to Dave. I can tell you are a good man.
Shushan
Reply
#40
gbausc Wrote:Hello Se7en.

Interesting name. What does it mean ?
You wrote :
Quote:Be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything

So true. Does that mean statistics are only good for manipulation?
They can also prove that a particular man is the father of a particular child.

i have submitted all the data to a professional statistician for verification. He says the codes are there by design, not chance. The stats are pretty easy to do.Everything is tested against control texts- non Bible texts searched for the same words at the same skip rates.

I don't subscribe to the idea that "
Quote:bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".


However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?

Blessings ,


Dave


Hi Dave:
I question this type of hypothesis that you have put forth, clever as it appears.

A statement was made:

I don't subscribe to the idea that "
Quote:bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".


Your answer:

"However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?"

Here, you equate ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament. Also, your answer is somewhat nebulous.

Yes, there are Bible Codes in the TORAH that I am aware of. Tav-Vav-Resh-Heh appears at a 50ELS from the first available TAV at the beginning of both Genesis/B'rayshi(T), Exodus/V'ayleh sh'mo(T). Wonderful and incredible. Most people with a fourth grade education can count the letters. That's a far cry from your research of statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament. To my knowledge, the Peshitta New Testament does not contain any significant, countable codes like the ones in the TORAH.

Find one. I challenge you to produce one, David. Find the word TORAH, or YESHUA at a 50 letter skip in the Peshitta New Testament, at the beginning of a book, from the first available TAV or YUD, whether in the 1905 Syriac Text (so called), or the Khabouris Codex.

Kind Regards,
Stephen
Reply
#41
gbausc Wrote:Hello Se7en.

Interesting name. What does it mean ?
You wrote :
Quote:Be careful with statistics cause you can manipulate them to "prove" anything

So true. Does that mean statistics are only good for manipulation?
They can also prove that a particular man is the father of a particular child.

i have submitted all the data to a professional statistician for verification. He says the codes are there by design, not chance. The stats are pretty easy to do.Everything is tested against control texts- non Bible texts searched for the same words at the same skip rates.

I don't subscribe to the idea that "
Quote:bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".


However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?

Blessings ,


Dave


Hi Dave:
I question this type of hypothesis that you have put forth, clever as it appears.

A statement was made:

I don't subscribe to the idea that "
Quote:bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".


Your answer:

"However, free will does not preclude all prophecy, does it ?
Do you believe the Bible has prophecy in it , and that some prophesy has been fulfilled ?
More importantly, do you believe God knows the future ?
If not, how could the Bible be true, which says, "he knows the end from the beginning", "His understanding is infinite", etc.. Does His foreknowledge preclude man's free will ?"

Here, you equate ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament. Also, your answer is somewhat nebulous.

Yes, there are Bible Codes in the TORAH that I am aware of. Tav-Vav-Resh-Heh appears at a 50ELS from the first available TAV at the beginning of both Genesis/B'rayshi(T), Exodus/V'ayleh sh'mo(T). Wonderful and incredible. Most people with a fourth grade education can count the letters. That's a far cry from your research of statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament. To my knowledge, the Peshitta New Testament does not contain any significant, countable codes like the ones in the TORAH.

Find one. I challenge you to produce one, David. Find the word TORAH, or YESHUA at a 50 letter skip in the Peshitta New Testament, at the beginning of a book, from the first available TAV or YUD, whether in the 1905 Syriac Text (so called), or the Khabouris Codex.

Kind Regards,
Stephen
Reply
#42
Shlama Steve,

I think you have misunderstood me in your quote of me above,
Quote:I don't subscribe to the idea that "Quote:
bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".

-I say I don't subscribe to that idea.

My post to Shushan about Bible prophecy was just that; I was not equating
Quote:"ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament."

I don't know how you arrive at that conclusion. I was simply establishing that God knows the future and has revealed it to men by prophecy. Shushan had said she didn't believe in that .


Yet you respond with:
Quote:Here, you equate ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament.

What could you be thinking here ?
What is your problem, Steve ?

I never even intimated such an idea.

As to the existence of codes, you have already admitted you believe they exist in the Torah.

So what's the problem with the idea that they exist in The Peshitta ?

Is that a heresy ?

If you want to verify them, get some software like Codefinder and test them for yourself.

Pr 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

Burkhtha,

Dave
Get my NT translations, books & articles at :
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://aramaicnt.com">http://aramaicnt.com</a><!-- m --> and Lulu.com
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Reply
#43
gbausc Wrote:Shlama Steve,

I think you have misunderstood me in your quote of me above,
Quote:I don't subscribe to the idea that "Quote:
bible codes already have all history encoded in them ".

-I say I don't subscribe to that idea.

My post to Shushan about Bible prophecy was just that; I was not equating
Quote:"ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament."

I don't know how you arrive at that conclusion. I was simply establishing that God knows the future and has revealed it to men by prophecy. Shushan had said she didn't believe in that .


Yet you respond with:
Quote:Here, you equate ALL Biblical prophesy with statistical analysis of the Peshitta New Testament.

What could you be thinking here ?
What is your problem, Steve ?

I never even intimated such an idea.

As to the existence of codes, you have already admitted you believe they exist in the Torah.

So what's the problem with the idea that they exist in The Peshitta ?

Is that a heresy ?

If you want to verify them, get some software like Codefinder and test them for yourself.

Pr 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

Burkhtha,

Dave

Hi Dave:
Any codes that you find in the Peshitta New Testament are random fluctuations of the text. Any text of similar length will show random levels of selected words. You have wrongly assumed that because they do appear in the TaNaK that they also appear in the Peshitta New Testament.

Also, Aramaic favours the use of certain letters in amounts that may tend to make certain words or "names" appear in a statistical search, more than in a control text. Perhaps this is what you are actually seeing.

It is incorrect to lump the Hebrew Bible and the Peshitta New Testament together and use the term Bible Codes to define both. They are two very separate studies.

When I refer to Bible Codes, personally I am referring to simple, countable words such as TORAH in Genesis 1:1-5 at a 50 ELS. The significance of 50 is "jubilee/setting free" and "sh'vuot/pentecost". This is the true "watermark".

Since there is always a random element, I restrict myself to "obvious watermarks". Also, I understand that these watermarks are there fore a purpose, and that is to be a spiritual and literary witness to the untampered text. They are not there for any purpose that would contradict what the text of the Bible literally teaches or warns about, such as divination. The so-called science of Bible Codes research is dominated by those that ignore such warnings.

I don't know when I decided this precisely, but some time ago I decided not to pursue New Testament Peshitta Codes. My deep desire is to understanding the actual text itself. I'm motivated by the need to change the Greek New Testament tradition that dominates Western Christianity. I'm finding the Khabouris Codex very interesting. :o)

I keep my eyes and ears open and I know that if there were ELS 50's of TORAH or YESHUA at the beginning of any New Testament book they would most certainly be published by now. Where are they, Dave?

In Christ,
Stephen Silver
Reply
#44
Hello Steve,

Quote:Any codes that you find in the Peshitta New Testament are random fluctuations of the text. Any text of similar length will show random levels of selected words.

Not so. There is a certain number to be expected randomly. That is easily computed by the software; it is based on the letter frequency of each letter contained in the searched word multiplied by the number of letters in the entire search text. Since you obviously believe it is a sin to analyze the Bible statistically, as you said, you don't have software that will search for words and analyze the statistics, now , do you ?
You only believe in codes you can count with your fingers; others are of the Devil, I suppose; kind of like the Amish man who believes a horse and buggy is from God but a car is of the Devil.

Quote:You have wrongly assumed that because they do appear in the TaNaK that they also appear in the Peshitta New Testament.
I have assumed nothing. I have observed them and compared them to Aramaic control texts, Hebrew control texts and the Hebrew Bible, as well as to The Greek NT and several English NT's.

It is you who assumes.


Quote:Also, Aramaic favours the use of certain letters in amounts that may tend to make certain words or "names" appear in a statistical search, more than in a control text. Perhaps this is what you are actually seeing.

No , it is not what I am seeing. The letter frequencies are accounted for in every search text and factored into the equation.
Expected numbers of words is calculated and is a very accurate formula. Only in The inspired scriptures (Hebrew and Aramaic) do we find abnormal numbers of ELS's over many searches.

Quote:It is incorrect to lump the Hebrew Bible and the Peshitta New Testament together and use the term Bible Codes to define both. They are two very separate studies.


You are the one lumping things. I have done very separate studies in both the Old Testament and in The New Testament. You have not, so you cannot speak with any authority because you don't know what you're talking about. It would behoove you to simply admit that rather than make a fool of yourself by pontificating and regularly sticking your foot in your mouth.

You have never searched the Peshitta for codes, except perhaps by the finger method, which is like looking for a needle in a haystack. The code software would be like a huge electromagnet that would pull the needle out of the haystack instantly, along with all magnetic metal in it.

You have failed to point out the verse that condemns Biblical analysis. That is a pretty serious charge to make, yet you seem to shoot fron the hip regularly and run when challenged on it.

The Bible condemns no such analysis; it does condemn bearing false witness and condemning people as heretics without evidence. A heretic is not merely someone you disagree with.
As far as "presuming to speak for God", it seems to me you so presume. You make outrageous charges of sin against me :
teaching deceitful doctrine, practicing divination, heresy, foisting a charade upon others- all without a scripture verse to support your position and all without any proof. You base it all on your opinion, and
hold forth as if your opinion is the Torah and The Gospel.

As far as I am concerned, you have disgraced yourself with your behavior and groundless accusations. You will never shame me with your arguments nor discredit my position, only your own.

If you think you can succeed by posting more of your nonsense, post away.I will only shake my head and wonder at your folly.

If you would do research on the subject, you would learn something about it. There are plenty of resources available. I know you don't oppose putting The Bible on the computer; why would you not search for Bible codes with a computer ?

Quote:Since there is always a random element, I restrict myself to "obvious watermarks". Also, I understand that these watermarks are there fore a purpose, and that is to be a spiritual and literary witness to the untampered text. They are not there for any purpose that would contradict what the text of the Bible literally teaches or warns about, such as divination. The so-called science of Bible Codes research is dominated by those that ignore such warnings.

My "Divine Names" experiment is just what you call "obvious watermarks". That was my entire purpose. What better watermarks would God put in the text as codes than His own Names and titles?

Know I know you have not read my material; you have simply "lumped" me in with all other code researchers and their methods. That is a very big mistake on your part.

Quote:I don't know when I decided this precisely, but some time ago I decided not to pursue New Testament Peshitta Codes.

Fine. That does not mean its wrong for everyone else who searches codes in the Peshitta.(BTW I don't believe anyone else has done so; as far as I know, only three people in the world have a Peshitta that is formatted for searching codes on the computer; I am one of them).


Quote:My deep desire is to understanding the actual text itself. I'm motivated by the need to change the Greek New Testament tradition that dominates Western Christianity. I'm finding the Khabouris Codex very interesting.

I couldn't agree more !



Quote:I keep my eyes and ears open and I know that if there were ELS 50's of TORAH or YESHUA at the beginning of any New Testament book they would most certainly be published by now. Where are they, Dave?

There is no one else to publish them but li'l
ole' me.

And I will; but let me say first that they will
not be merely ELS 50's of TORAH; they will cover the 60's , 70's, 80's and 90's, right uo from the 02's to now and everything between. If you're going to search codes, you search all of them, or go back to your day job.
The Peshitta has more highly significant numbers of TORAH code ELS's than the Torah has; certainly more than any control text.

To be continued !

Dave

To be con
Get my NT translations, books & articles at :
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Reply
#45
gbausc Wrote:Hello Steve,

Quote:Any codes that you find in the Peshitta New Testament are random fluctuations of the text. Any text of similar length will show random levels of selected words.

Not so. There is a certain number to be expected randomly. That is easily computed by the software; it is based on the letter frequency of each letter contained in the searched word multiplied by the number of letters in the entire search text. Since you obviously believe it is a sin to analyze the Bible statistically, as you said, you don't have software that will search for words and analyze the statistics, now , do you ?
You only believe in codes you can count with your fingers; others are of the Devil, I suppose; kind of like the Amish man who believes a horse and buggy is from God but a car is of the Devil.

Quote:You have wrongly assumed that because they do appear in the TaNaK that they also appear in the Peshitta New Testament.
I have assumed nothing. I have observed them and compared them to Aramaic control texts, Hebrew control texts and the Hebrew Bible, as well as to The Greek NT and several English NT's.

It is you who assumes.


Quote:Also, Aramaic favours the use of certain letters in amounts that may tend to make certain words or "names" appear in a statistical search, more than in a control text. Perhaps this is what you are actually seeing.

No , it is not what I am seeing. The letter frequencies are accounted for in every search text and factored into the equation.
Expected numbers of words is calculated and is a very accurate formula. Only in The inspired scriptures (Hebrew and Aramaic) do we find abnormal numbers of ELS's over many searches.

Quote:It is incorrect to lump the Hebrew Bible and the Peshitta New Testament together and use the term Bible Codes to define both. They are two very separate studies.


You are the one lumping things. I have done very separate studies in both the Old Testament and in The New Testament. You have not, so you cannot speak with any authority because you don't know what you're talking about. It would behoove you to simply admit that rather than make a fool of yourself by pontificating and regularly sticking your foot in your mouth.

You have never searched the Peshitta for codes, except perhaps by the finger method, which is like looking for a needle in a haystack. The code software would be like a huge electromagnet that would pull the needle out of the haystack instantly, along with all magnetic metal in it.

You have failed to point out the verse that condemns Biblical analysis. That is a pretty serious charge to make, yet you seem to shoot fron the hip regularly and run when challenged on it.

The Bible condemns no such analysis; it does condemn bearing false witness and condemning people as heretics without evidence. A heretic is not merely someone you disagree with.
As far as "presuming to speak for God", it seems to me you so presume. You make outrageous charges of sin against me :
teaching deceitful doctrine, practicing divination, heresy, foisting a charade upon others- all without a scripture verse to support your position and all without any proof. You base it all on your opinion, and
hold forth as if your opinion is the Torah and The Gospel.

As far as I am concerned, you have disgraced yourself with your behavior and groundless accusations. You will never shame me with your arguments nor discredit my position, only your own.

If you think you can succeed by posting more of your nonsense, post away.I will only shake my head and wonder at your folly.

If you would do research on the subject, you would learn something about it. There are plenty of resources available. I know you don't oppose putting The Bible on the computer; why would you not search for Bible codes with a computer ?

Quote:Since there is always a random element, I restrict myself to "obvious watermarks". Also, I understand that these watermarks are there fore a purpose, and that is to be a spiritual and literary witness to the untampered text. They are not there for any purpose that would contradict what the text of the Bible literally teaches or warns about, such as divination. The so-called science of Bible Codes research is dominated by those that ignore such warnings.

My "Divine Names" experiment is just what you call "obvious watermarks". That was my entire purpose. What better watermarks would God put in the text as codes than His own Names and titles?

Know I know you have not read my material; you have simply "lumped" me in with all other code researchers and their methods. That is a very big mistake on your part.

Quote:I don't know when I decided this precisely, but some time ago I decided not to pursue New Testament Peshitta Codes.

Fine. That does not mean its wrong for everyone else who searches codes in the Peshitta.(BTW I don't believe anyone else has done so; as far as I know, only three people in the world have a Peshitta that is formatted for searching codes on the computer; I am one of them).


Quote:My deep desire is to understanding the actual text itself. I'm motivated by the need to change the Greek New Testament tradition that dominates Western Christianity. I'm finding the Khabouris Codex very interesting.

I couldn't agree more !



Quote:I keep my eyes and ears open and I know that if there were ELS 50's of TORAH or YESHUA at the beginning of any New Testament book they would most certainly be published by now. Where are they, Dave?

There is no one else to publish them but li'l
ole' me.

And I will; but let me say first that they will
not be merely ELS 50's of TORAH; they will cover the 60's , 70's, 80's and 90's, right uo from the 02's to now and everything between. If you're going to search codes, you search all of them, or go back to your day job.
The Peshitta has more highly significant numbers of TORAH code ELS's than the Torah has; certainly more than any control text.

To be continued !

Dave

To be con

Hi David:
Let's keep this simple. It's not at all wrong for you or me or anyone else to use a statistical program to analyse the Bible, in either Hebrew or Aramaic, Greek or English, etc....

However, you are publishing your results and this means that others read your stuff. I'm just trying to keep you honest. If you go public, I go public. I don't challenge you publicly to embarass you or belittle you. I actually think I'm trying to help you. However, you don't appear to see it that way.

If I have overstepped the line on this, I apologise. Don't misconstrue this though. I find fault in carrying statistical analysis of the Bible too far. Your "Names of God" statistical analysis appears to me to go too far, because it's not strictly an analysis. You have added this assumption.

Quote:My Hypothesis: If God were to put codes in the Bible, He would certainly leave a signature in it using the names and titles of God which are mentioned in the plain Bible text, and insure that they occur in highly significant numbers, far beyond or below statistically expected amounts. These would constitute a divine signature of the Author of the books individually, the separate testaments and the Bible as a whole.

Remove the assumption, David. You cannot speak for God in this way, with impunity. It will be challenged because it's a false hypothesis. If it's not me, someone else will come along and challenge your hypothesis for the very same reason.

BTW, don't kid yourself into thinking that you have "exclusive Peshitta software".

David, before you answer this post please understand that I'm not out to get you. I'm only interested in the TRUTH. You appear to me to be way too close to this stuff. Step back and see the forest and the beauty of the WORD of GOD, not just in an analytical way but because the same One that Authored the WORD of GOD also Authored our salvation.

Love in Christ,
Stephen Silver
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