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Help! Question about Hebrew vs Aramaic primacy via examples.
#1
Bivin and Blizzard cite the following examples as evidence that the NT, at least the gospels through part of Acts, was written in Hebrew:

Use of ochloi in NT Greek (???multitudes???) is a transliteration of Hebrew ochlosim, ???the people of a locality??? (16).

Luke 10:9??????The kingdom of God {has arrived}.??? (The Greek verb engiken translates the Hebrew idiomatic verb karav, ???come near,??? which means ???come and be with??? or ???be where something or someone else is.???)

Tzedekah (???righteousness???) is a Hebraic synonym for ???salvation???:

Matthew 6:33??????Seek first His kingdom and His {salvation}??????
Matthew 5:6??????Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for
{salvation}??????

???Judgment??? is also a Hebraic synonym for ???salvation???:

Matthew 12:8??????Here is my servant???. And he will proclaim
{salvation} to the Gentiles.???


Matthew 5:42a??????Give to him who asks you for a loan, and do not refuse him who wishes to borrow from you.??? (Hebrew verb ???ask??? is synonym for ???borrow,??? as it is used here in Hebrew poetic couplet form. The words here are not repetitive, but one refers to borrowing an item to be returned and the other to replacing an item "lent" that has been used up, like money or a cup of flour.)

Matthew 5:10??????Blessed are they who pursue salvation, for of such is the kingdom of heaven.??? (???Persecute??? is a mistranslation of the Hebrew verb radaf, tzedekah or ???righteousness??? is idiomatic for ???salvation,??? and ???of such??? parallels the correct translation of the same word in Luke 18:16.)

Luke 12:49-50??????I am come??? is idiomatic Hebrew for ???My purpose is??? (and as used elsewhere): ???{My purpose is} to send fire on the earth; but how could I wish it were already burned up? But I have a baptism to give, and how distressed I am till it is over!??? A parallel to Matthew 3:11 (???He will baptize you . . . with fire???), structured as Hebrew poetry, as a repetitive couplet of judgment and regret, judgment and regret; the Greek aorist elthon, ???come,??? renders the Hebrew past. See also Luke 19:10. The Hebrew word ???what??? also can mean ???how,??? as Greek kai can mean ???but,??? which completes the couplet.

Matthew 5:20???Pun, play on double-meaning of tzedekah (???righteousness???), which had come to be synonymous with ???almsgiving??? (as a redemptive act of righteousness).

Luke 6:22???Hebraic idiom ???cast not your name evil??? means ???Malign you.???


So, what I would like to know is whether the above examples work just as well in Aramaic, and correct the Greek or English just as well, as the authors claim the Hebrew does. Can anyone help me with this matter?
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#2
Shlama,

These guys sound like they have no idea what they are talking about. I've heard of these two characters before......not good stuff, either.

Everything they said works equally well in the Aramaic, from which Hebrew is descended in the first place.

They sound like they are purposely being vague in order to deceive people who would not know the difference.......
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#3
Thank you! I can read Greek at an extremely elementary level, and am rusty on Hebrew that I never knew even remotely as well as I did Greek (especially when not transliterated into our alphabet). Needless to say, then, I don't know Aramaic, cannot read Aramaic script, and have trouble as well with the transliterations I have seen that mix numerals and other symbols not in our alphabet, let alone appear to skip transliterating vowel points. With all that said, would you be able to tell me what the Aramaic words are in the gospel passages that Bivin and Blizzard used as examples of Hebrew below? As an utter novice, I would appreciate it if you would give the standard transliteration (the one that looks funky to me) as well as an anglicized one that includes vowels so that I can pronounce them; if there's some equivalent to a Strong's number used in your lexicon or other routinely consulted work on the Aramaic, that would be wonderful.

As I plan to study all this myself, I won't always be so relatively helpless, but it would be very nice at this point if you would indulge me. Thanks again!

The Aramaic equivalent of ochlosim, ???the people of a locality????

The Aramaic equivalent of the Hebrew idiomatic verb karav, ???come near????

The Aramaic equivalent for tzedekah, meaning ???righteousness,??? ???salvation,??? and "alms"?

The two Aramaic words in Matthew 5:42a that mean "ask" for something to be repaid later and "borrow" something that would be returned?

The Aramaic word in Matthew 5:10 equivalent to radaf that Zorba mistranslated as "persecute"?


If I remember correctly, Bivin and Blizzard claimed to have reconstructed the "original" Hebrew by translating the Greek back into Hebrew using a comparison of LXX and Masoretic vocabulary.
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#4
Shlama Tauf,

Taufgesinnter Wrote:The Aramaic equivalent of ochlosim, ???the people of a locality????

"Akhlose". (same word)

Taufgesinnter Wrote:The Aramaic equivalent of the Hebrew idiomatic verb karav, ???come near????

"Qarab". (same word)

Taufgesinnter Wrote:The Aramaic equivalent for tzedekah, meaning ???righteousness,??? ???salvation,??? and "alms"?

"Zadeqa". (same word)

Taufgesinnter Wrote:The two Aramaic words in Matthew 5:42a that mean "ask" for something to be repaid later and "borrow" something that would be returned?

"Shaal" and "Nazep".

Taufgesinnter Wrote:The Aramaic word in Matthew 5:10 equivalent to radaf that Zorba mistranslated as "persecute"?

"Radap". (same word)

Taufgesinnter Wrote:If I remember correctly, Bivin and Blizzard claimed to have reconstructed the "original" Hebrew by translating the Greek back into Hebrew using a comparison of LXX and Masoretic vocabulary.

Yes, "Hebrew Primacists" are very much into reconstruction - if you know what I mean. <!-- sWink --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/wink1.gif" alt="Wink" title="Wink" /><!-- sWink -->
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#5
Thanks very much!

Tauf
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#6
Hi T,

I don't know if this is what you are after, but Paul has a very good article in the articles section, dealing with Jesus' genealogies, and how the Hebrew versions of Matthew are corrupt, while the Aramaic is the only one where it all makes sense <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile -->
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#7
That sounds helpful, thanks!

Tauf
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#8
Hi there Tauf!...good to see you here.

<!-- s:biggrin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/biggrin.gif" alt=":biggrin:" title="Big Grin" /><!-- s:biggrin: -->
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#9
Thanks!
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#10
~Waves hello~

Long time no see :-)

-Steve-o
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#11
*waving* Yeah, I PM'd you you-know-where. Waiting for a reply on a thread there. Although I forget what it was about now; it may have been an issue that's been answered here. <!-- sHuh --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/huh.gif" alt="Huh" title="Huh" /><!-- sHuh -->
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