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For Love of Money
#1
Hello,

I'm new to the board and I was interested in learning the aramaic to english translation for 1Peter 6:10.

I've read the Lasma translation;
For the love of money is the root of all evil; and there are some men who have coveted it and thereby erred from their faith and brought to them many sorrows.

Is this the accurate translation? I've read the Latin and the Greek versions and there appears to be discrepencies to the different versions. I'm most interested in understanding the definition for the root. Was love of money, or greed, or averice being used as an example for the root so that could easily be understood for the time or is it more definitive. My suspicion is that the scripture passage was suggesting that to covet one's carnal desire (greed, lust, power, etc...) would lead one stray away from their conviction to God and consequently bring about suffering.

Also, is there any inference to the last portion of the passage, and brought to them many sorrows, that may be suggestive to the earlier part of the passage regarding coveting the desire. The suggestion being that the sorrow or suffering be related to coveting the desire rather than be the consequence of erring in their faith.

Thanks, Jon
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#2
Welcome to the board Jon. You may have been referring to 1Tim 6:10.

K:STongue in Hebrew is "silver". So it is likely that it is "silver" in Aramaic as well.
R:Ch:M in Hebrew and Aramaic tends to denote "favor", "preference", "likeability" etc. I am skeptical that the word "love" is an appropriate translation for it. Better perhaps for the Ch:B stem.

My guess at this time, is that the Aramaic is somewhat in this manner:

The root of that, of all them the bad; being him the preference of silver.
And being the men, of much they be desired to him.
And from the faith they stray, and their soul, they lead to the miseries the many.
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#3
Sure it is love or friendship (for silver) based on the word 'rahim' (compare abraham = ibn-rahim)

You can safely translate money. Ancient currency was silver/gold. Todays currency is just generally 'money'

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#4
Shlama,

i did a personal translation of this book about a month ago, and here's how i chose to translate it:

for the root of all these evils is the love of silver, and there are men who have lusted for it, and have wandered from the trust, and their souls have been brought to many miseries.

silver is definitely the literal translation, but money works dynamically, and is fine in that respect.

i've also noticed a subtle differentiation between RKHM and KHB at times, like in Timothy and in 1st John, where i can think of at the moment, which appears to show KHB as more spiritual/positive when used in comparison. of course, RKHM is also able to be used in an entirely positive/spiritual sense, as well. the context really determines how it should be seen. "love" works in my opinion, because that is where their desires are at - what they hold most dear.


Chayim b'Moshiach,
Jeremy
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#5
From what I can tell, R:Ch:M peal, which is used in this verse, has a connotation of "to favor" or "to prefer". One noun form of it is "friend", logically derived from a "favored" or "preferred" person. The noun form used in this verse appears to be "the favor" or "the preference" itself. So "the favoring of silver" or "the favor of silver" is certainly as appropriate as "the preference of silver".

This is how Payne Smith lists the `Ch:B aphel stem, which I tend to think is the right stem for "love":

to kindle; to love; that ye should love one another; whoso loveth; to be loved; beloved; beloved of God

For me, I am not comfortable with using "love" for both the R:Ch:M and Ch:B stems, but instead for the stem for which it seems most contextually appropriate, the Ch:B stem.
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#6
Jerry Wrote:From what I can tell, R:Ch:M peal, which is used in this verse, denotes the connotation of "to favor" or "to prefer". One noun form of it is "friend", logically derived from a "favored" or "preferred" person. The noun form used in this verse appears to be "the favor" or "the preference" itself. So "the favoring of silver" or "the favor of silver" is certainly as appropriate as "the preference of silver".

This is how Payne Smith lists the `Ch:B aphel stem, which I tend to think is the right stem for "love":

to kindle; to love; that ye should love one another; whoso loveth; to be loved; beloved; beloved of God

For me, I am not comfortable with using "love" for both the R:Ch:M and Ch:B stems, but instead for the stem for which it seems most contextually appropriate, the Ch:B stem.

Shlama,

i agree that the idea of RKHM is more of a preference/desire than the KHB of a beloved sense. my only reservation is the way it is used in such close proximity to KHB at times, like, for instance, in 2 Timothy 3:4, or 1 John 2:15. it would appear that the authors included the separate terms to differentiate the subtle nuance between the ideas being proposed.

Interestingly, the Pehitta AN"K and Hebrews 12:6, which is quoting from it, uses RKHM, where the Hebrew text itself uses the AHAB root. it would be an interesting study to check the various places in the Peshitta NT that are quotations from the Hebrew which have RKHM / KHB, and see what the word is in the original Hebrew, to try to ascertain if there is any method to the translation process concerning choice of term.


Chayim b'Moshiach,
Jeremy
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#7
Good points. Not only is there a subtle nuance between R:Ch:M and Ch:B, but also nuances within their own forms. Ch:B has a peal, pael, and aphel form; and R:Ch:M a peal and pael. It makes for quite a challenge.
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#8
Thanks for your responses. Much appreciated.

Quote: Burning one wrote:
for the root of all these evils is the love of silver, and there are men who have lusted for it, and have wandered from the trust, and their souls have been brought to many miseries.

Is this a reasonably accurate translation?

Quote: Jerry wrote:
From what I can tell, R:Ch:M peal, which is used in this verse, has a connotation of "to favor" or "to prefer". One noun form of it is "friend", logically derived from a "favored" or "preferred" person. The noun form used in this verse appears to be "the favor" or "the preference" itself. So "the favoring of silver" or "the favor of silver" is certainly as appropriate as "the preference of silver".

Could it be translated as; for the root of all these evils is the desire of the favor of silver? Or, maybe, for the root of these evils is the friendship to silver?

Just wondering if the inference is not in regards to a monetary tool, but rather to what it can provide, as in worldly desires?

Also, different interpretations conflict to whether the love of silver/money is the root or a root to evil?
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